Yakkstr

We should get back to basics

A few days ago one of our posters put up a cute video proping up capitalism. It's the kind of bland drivel that any adult should see through but not all do. I keep hearing people telling me about how America was founded on the principles of capitalism. Whenever I ask them what they were fleeing and reminding them that we'd been a country for over a century before socialism or communism even existed as concepts they tend to get very very quiet. I didn't know why it kept nagging at me that people saw the founding of this nation that way and then I looked around modern America and realized that conservatives are right. We should return to our roots, and end this recession.

Right now in Georgia, Washington, Alabama and several other states we're pissing away millions of dollars and thousand of jobs. It turns out various combinations of a poor economy, Obama's increased enforcement and several states putting new laws in place to prevent illegal aliens from working has caused a labor shortage in the agriculture business. We can do the liberal thing and start preparing a path to if not citizenship at least to legal resident or we can do the right thing and continue these programs. The labor shortage is easy enough to solve actually. Most of us agree that dirty, rotten murderers, rapists, robbers, a drug addicts shouldn't get a free ride. I have to get off my ass to get three hots and a cot why shouldn't they? Of course someone should profit from housing these criminals. and since a full jail produces more labor than an empty one it would be wise to keep as many laws on the books as possible instead of decriminalizing stuff. If that doesn't work add laws to the books I say we take after Arizona and simply put laws into place to round up anybody who doesn't appear American. It's a pretty good plan since they have a difficult time blending in should they escape. After all most of them look the same

I know there is some term for people you capture and use as labor. Shit, shouldn't have had that drink cus I know it's a basic word. Oh well I'm sure one of you knows what that word is. I think a bunch of liberals (who happened to be Republicans) ended this practice in America for some reason or another. That's probably when America started down the shitter because we'd gone against the Founding Fathers.

That cute video I mentioned earlier told me that in a capitalist society he who works the hardest and puts for the most effort get the richest. It's absolutely true and that's what this great nation was founded on. By the sweat of your brow shall your fortune be made. I figure if it worked for the Founding Fathers it should be a sound plan and we should do like Republicans want and return this country to the traditions that made us great. Every job outsourced or given to an illegal takes us one step closer to the Founding Fathers if you believe the

I say it's time we had ourselves a Tea Party. I mean a real one, lets get rowdy. Or is that only for hippy, OWS, socialist bitches these days? If the Tea Party wants to keep pointing out that OWS gets arrested and they don't all I can say is I think an actual conservative, a freedom fighting American, would be proud to have started a war and to die in the streets until they'd earned the freedom they wanted. I highly doubt the real Tea Party would have gotten away with zero arrests had the British had the power to anything about it.

We can debate whether or not Iraq and Afghanistan (and the other measures like Homeland Security) that have happened over the the last decade were truly in our best interests we can't deny that the situation we find ourselves in is eerily similar to that of the Founding Fathers. We start with a war against psuedo-terrorists and a bunch of pussies, the FRENCH that cost the government a fuck ton of money that they tried to get in taxes and history tells us that no matter what two hundred years right wing revionist history has taught us it wasn't taxation. It was not having a seat at the table that pissed off Americans. The ones I already pointed out were making their fortunes from the sweat of their own brows. Oh wait do we currently have a debt for a war to pay for that the people it was fought on behalf (take Americans as a whole or rich Americans it makes no difference to my point) that we refuse to pay for? Really we do? Fuck. We did however do the right thing both during the founders time and today. We rejected higher taxes. Paying for your protection is dirty commie think. Either it takes care of itself or eventually it'll become enough of a problem that one of us will solve it singlehandedly, cus that how Capitalists roll.

So lets do this. Everybody vote Republican and this recession will end in 2013 and we'll start racing back to the top. I've shown my work. The Founding Fathers had it right. Lets do like the Right says so often and return to our glorious roots. I've shown you all the money we're pissing away, and the jobs. I've been a fool.

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alienated said over 2 years ago ...

I know, in your drunken and/or drugged state, you think you are making sense, but not really. If Hollywood has taught us anything, it is that any subject can be skewed, or made fun of, or warped to seem one way when, in fact, it is not that way at all. Capitalism and Socialism are pretty much just labels that we put on extremes that we seldom really achieve in real life. We basically have a Capitalist system, but, as you have often pointed out, not really. We now have a mixture of Capitalism and FDR / LBJ / Obama Socialism. Many of us are now invested in LBJ's Great Society, having "donated" so much of our paychecks for so many years to Social Security, Medicaid/Medicare, and what not. Capitalism and Socialism are simply terms, now, that are code words for "stop fucking people over" and "stop giving shit to lazy people and people who come here illegally". As you say, few of us would want to live under pure Capitalism OR pure Socialism. I was recently evaluating what I really think about illegal immigration and I had to admit that I really do not give a crap if Mexicans come here as long as they work and stay out of trouble. Of course, some of them, like most poor people, are a burden on Society and make a big mess even if they do not mean to. I was also thinking that my dad and his crew (mostly white guys) made a living for themselves and their families by doing work that is done pretty exclusively by Mexicans these days. A young white kid mowed my lawn for many years while he attended high school and college. Mexicans (and I when unemployed) have mowed my lawn for the last decade or more. If those jobs went undone for very long, white guys (and black guys) would eventually start doing them again just as they did in the past because people would eventually start paying more to get the work done, and that would eventually attract people like my dad and his crew. That really is Capitalism. And I think maybe you are starting to realize that even if you seem snide about it, and hate to admit that it really works better. Socialism basically gives people a fish for a day. Capitalism shows people the river, gets out of the way, and lets them catch all the fish they can eat for as long as they need to. Capitalism is what attracts all those illegals. Socialism is what turns many of them into criminals and leeches.

sean_renaud said over 2 years ago ...

I never once denied that a mixed system works better. You're the one who constantly attempts to deny it. If however as you say capitalism shows people a river and gets out of the way what is the proper response when someone gets rich, damns up the river and goes net fishing? That's fundamentally what bankers do when they print money?

What do you do when the rich have successfully made you 100% dependent on them for your life. I assume you'd agree that if I find you treading water in the ocean, dehydrated in the desert or freezing in the snow any "deal" we make is made under duress? Sure it might take a little while but how is that any different from today's system of work or be homeless? It made sense when everybody was a farmer and when you didn't need a license to go hunting but today you're pretty much under the gun.

As your finally getting around to Capitalism and Socialism can coexist and in America have done a damn good job of not only co-existing but of helping each other reach untold heights of acheivement. So why the fuck have we spent the last few decades cutting back? If you're smart enough to realize it's working you should be smart enough to keep it working.

mgibbosh said over 2 years ago ...

Alienated Capitalism and Socialism teaches us the dependence of interdependence. To much of one makes the other a necessity. Take the crash of 2008 the capitalism was working extremely well until the capitalist reached the Peter Principle and made to much of a good thing by not knowing their limitations and then they turned socialist and begged the federal government for 760 billion dollars to cover mistakes that capitalism was supposed to avoid. The crash wasn't caused by Illegals or lazy people but by a bunch of greedy capitalist who failed to recognize their limitations.

Your prejudice tell us what you think of illegals but the Republican employer see's the illegal as a financial benefit simply because he is not required to keep account of the taxes he owes the government, pay part of social security, medicare and unemployment insurance. The Republican Economist see him as an economic benefit to society because he purchases homes, cars, groceries, payes local and state taxes, utility bills and fights in our military.

The Democratic politician see's them as a political benefit because they vote overwhelmingly democratic and they are the fastest growing voting block in America but who can blame him from the way the Republican party treats them. The good old days of your father are gone forever and irregardless of how nostalgic you become they are never going to return. Socialism and capitalism must be balanced on the need of society each one purely by itself is like a two headed snake that eats you from both ends. Socialistic programs like social security medicare welfare and unemployment insurance was not a figment of some ones imagination they were needed to solve critical problems caused by the capitalist crash of 1929.

sean_renaud said over 2 years ago ...

It's considerably more complicated than that even. There are certain things you can't make a profit doing, certainly not in the traditional free market where competition drives people to perform. Sewers,water distribution, trash collecting, hell anything that is basic infrastructure tends not to work particularly well as a for profit venture. There are things you debatably shouldn't make a profit on prisons, military, education. These are things you either need but don't want to use (prisons, military) or in the case of education it doesn't seem like in practice that people are competing to create more product at a lower price. In fact it seems that all of the big schools seem to have a silent agreement to produce less at a higher price. As strong as the brand name is there is absolutely no excuse for Harvard or Yale to have at least a dozen campuses spread out through the nation. I know finding quality educators is difficult but to believe that education handled on a largely capitalist philosophy we have to convince ourselves that in the 375 years that Harvards existed they either a) couldn't find enough demand for their product any place else in America (or abroad) or b) that teachers are so fucking rare they couldn't possible find enough teachers to staff even a second location. If you find either of those arguments at all compelling I'd like to see your logic. I'm fairly convinced this is a simple case of artificial rarity. Education costs an arm and a leg for the same reason Kobe Bryant rookie cards are. They only printed a few thousand and they won't make any more.

mgibbosh said over 2 years ago ...

You are right have you noticed that all the top 500 CEOs are from the Harvard business school and that 8 of the supreme court judges are from Harvard or Yale law school, we can't include Clarance Thomas because they don't allow him to ask questions are right decisions. These people get in positions and perpetuate the cycle of if you are not from one of these institutions you are not among the elite of society.

alienated said over 2 years ago ...

We have spent the last couple of decades cutting back? WTF? What country do you live in?

As far as what I think of illegals, I think they are illegal. You are the one confusing my feelings about illegals with my feelings about Mexicans, and that is really what most Liberals / Democrats / Socialist are doing. I actually understand why they come here and why they keep coming here. It is a problem caused by both parties. I am actually of the "it is what it is" school of thought. I am smart enough to know that in one generation, Mexicans (or Russians, or Vietnamese, blah blah blah) can become Americans and love this country just as much as I do. The problem is when we let just anyone waltz across the border and do whatever they want when they get here. Obviously, the number of Mexicans in jail proves that not all of them get to do anything they want. But they should not be in jail here. They should be in jail in Mexico.

As far as the crash of 2008, I blame that squarely on Liberals / Democrats / Socialists. They started screwing with the housing business back in Jimmy Carter's day and people like Barney Franklicker have just made it worse. If you do some honest research, you will find that to be the real truth. L / D / Ss like to spin it as the result of big business / Capitialism out of control, but that is hogwash. As Mark Levin said the other day, everything big government gets involved in (the post office, public schools, health care / medicaid / medicare, the environment, the VA, social security, on and on) goes to crap sooner or later. As I have said elsewhere, Capitalism creates an environment for personal achievement (people like Steve Jobs and Bill Gates) and Socialism creates an environment of misery and handouts from the government. Yes, some things have to be regulated, but not EVERYTHING has to be regulated. Look at the EPA. They are the direct cause of higher gasoline prices. Period. We have enough oil in the country to make us energy independent, but much of it is on government land, which is off limits. Why? Because dipshits like Obama and the tree huggers at the EPA want us dependent on the government and because environmental groups have deep pockets and they contribute to Obama and people like him. Follow the money and see where it leads. Neither extreme is desireable, but the extreme Left is way too in control of all our lives and that must be stopped. Vote for Republicans until it goes too far the other way. That is what I plan to do, but it rarely goes too far the other way, or at least in recent history (as I said, I do not know what Sean is talkin about and I wonder if he does).

alienated said over 2 years ago ...

He is right about the sewers, water, etc. That is what government is supposed to do, not regulate your calorie intake or stop people from drilling for much need oil. As I have also said, people like Obama want government to do all the things it should not do and not to do all the things it should do. Just part of the ass backward times in which we live.

And you are wrong about Clarence Thomas,also. He chooses not to ask questions because he feels it is a waste of time. They are given a problem / a question / a case and they look at the law and the constitution, or they should. Thomas thinks that the lawyers blather in front of them is neither here nor there so he asks no questions. Look it up.

sean_renaud said over 2 years ago ...

Yes we've been cutting back. Schools have increasing class sizes because we refuse not only to pay teachers but to hire more so we can keep class sizes small. We've slashed welfare in 96 and at best it's had mixed results. We've closed down NASA. Union's are at an all time low., I chose the article because it's fairly neutral. At the very least you can't claim that welfare has destroyed the black family, and there is certainly evidence to suggest that welfare polices (some real some imagined) at the very least didn't help the situation. Sadly part of the problem is that as we continue to modernize jobs are going to become increasingly rare. If you can point me in the direction of a profession that not simply rising, but rising fast enough to take over for the massive shedding of jobs we're experiencing. I think you'll like this one. but my point however is that with kindle to compete with books and magazines (pause here and think about book stores. It's not just cashiers, it's drivers, warehouse workers, printers, forklift drivers.) Oh and with netflix I don't predict a long future for Blockbuster, do you? Or are you claiming you think the Ipad and other Mp3 players aren't going to put a lot of people out of work. I suppose you've neve heard of Steam. I'm not even going to bother linking the Post Office, I'm simply going to state that entire industry is going to be obsolete rather soon, library too. We're knocking out jobs as fast as we can. It didn't turn out well for the US during the Industrial Revolution, it didn't turn out well in the 80's and it won't turn out well this time.

ALIENated was educaction part of the ect?

alienated said over 2 years ago ...

Most of us taxpayers do not want to educate the children of illegal immigrants. Look at the California schools. I saw a picture a while back of a California classroom. Nearly every face was brown. The ones that were not, were black or Asian or Muslim. Whites have fled the government schools. If they would do the right thing, maybe whites would come back and so would the money.

sean_renaud said over 2 years ago ...

They're here and we don't currently have a better answer than educating them for a number of reasons. I'd love to start cutting back on the number of them in the country however referencing back to my original post. Right now we are pissing away millions of dollars and thousands of jobs because we won't cover our eyes and pretend we don't see what's happening like we always do.

It would be fine in a booming economy. Republicans, if they had two brain cells to click together which I'm rapidly begining to doubt, would focus on the economy right now 100% ignore the Mexicans, they aren't the problem. The banks and an overconcentration of wealth are. Get on the train. Once the economy is up start pushing for immigration law to be enforced. Most Americans don't like illegals but ignore them so long as they stay out of sight and out of mind but they'll back you.

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And there goes that white privilege again. No, she's not doing anything to elevate her race. You are a fucking racist and I thought you weren't. I thought better of you. But you've proven me wrong and I think I'm gonna go have a drink and mourn read the rest
sean_renaud commented 21 days ago on
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